David Richman | Wake Up Call

What does it take to bicycle 4700 miles, with temps most often over 100 degrees and the wind against you?

David Richman did just that as part of a passion project that later became his book, Cycle of Lives, where all proceeds benefit cancer-focused charities.

However, David didn’t wake up one day and decide to make Cycle of Lives his mission. Instead, it was years in the making, following the death of his dear sister, June, due to brain cancer.

David’s sister’s diagnosis was the icing on the cake of what he was already struggling with in his life. One question he asked himself would set him on a path of personal transformation.

Listen to David’s story of transformation and what has inspired him throughout his life. Hear some of the stories that have most inspired him and some golden nuggets he’s picked up along the way.

Be sure to listen to this one all the way through! This episode is the perfect inspiration for the start of 2022!

RESOURCES:

• Book | Cycle of Lives
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Transcript

Victoria Volk  00:56
Thank you for tuning in to grieving voices. today. My guest is David Richman. He is an author, public speaker, philanthropist and endurance athlete who, whose mission is to form more meaningful human connections through storytelling. In his first book, winning the middle of the pack, he discussed how to get more out of ourselves than ever imagined. With cycle of lives. David shares the interconnected stories of people overcoming trauma and delves deeply into their emotional journeys within with cancer. He continues to do Ironman triathlons and a wide range of endurance athletic events. Having recently completed a solo 4700-mile bike ride. He is married and lives in Southern Nevada and has twins who are in college. Thank you so much for being here.

 
David Richman  01:47
Thank you, Victoria. I'm looking forward to talking to you. 

Victoria Volk  01:50
Yeah, I actually saw a little fun fact. I looked up really like where would 4700 miles, where could that get me? But from Kansas. If you flew from Kansas 4700 miles, you get to Belgium. Kansas to Belgium is 4700 miles.

David Richman  02:10
That's a lot of miles. It also gets you from LA to San Diego, across Arizona, to Albuquerque, down to Dallas and then Austin and then back up to Houston. Through the panhandle of Florida down to Tampa, over to Orlando. And then up to New York City. That's 4700 miles.

 
Victoria Volk  02:40
Wow. Yeah. Wow. I've seen bikers like coming through. I'm in North Dakota, they come through and it's like 85 degrees and they're biking up going on like I just about anybody who can first of all, I think it's hard enough running but biking up a hill? I don't know.

 
David Richman  03:01
Yeah, it was tough in you know, the first 12 days. The high was never below 100. It was a rough start.

 
Victoria Volk  03:13
How do you do it? I mean, I know we'll get there like in this conversation, but like just the mental fortitude that that takes?

 
David Richman  03:21
Yeah, that one. That one was tough. I think the toughest thing about the bike ride really like physically the toughest thing was, it was it was shocking how and I'm not even exaggerating, Victoria, it was shocking how no matter what direction I went, the wind was in my face. It was it was maddening. I had one day, one day outside of Albuquerque. So, from Albuquerque to wherever I went that day where the wind was behind me. And it was my shortest day by four hours on the bike in the entire 45 days. I don't think I ever had a day where the wind wasn't in my face. It was maddening. Maddening.

 
Victoria Volk  04:02
What an incredible feat. I mean, you could probably just did you document that journey?

 
David Richman  04:07
So I did. So, the book is written first person from each of the 15 participants. So, I I interviewed them got their stories, and I wrote their story. First Person has them. Okay, or third person has them. But still it was there was their perspective. In between each of those stories is a short little narrative that talks about the bike ride my feelings about the person that whose story just ended or the person whose story was coming. And then you know, some of the people I met along the way and my own dealing with the grief of losing my sister to cancer. So, it's a it's a narrative that kind of binds those stories together.

 
Victoria Volk  04:55
How did this come to fruition? This mission to 4700-mile bike ride?

 
David Richman  05:02
Well, so the bike ride was kind of a little bit of an afterthought. What I what I wanted to do was, so my sister had been diagnosed with terminal brain cancer. Okay, so she had a young family, job, friends, the whole thing, very vibrant woman, you know, living her fullest life. And she was faced with this reality. And her and I talked about things a lot, maybe not every aspect of of what was going to happen, but pretty much we talked a lot. And I did a Relay for Life near the end of her actually, a couple of days after she passed away, I did a Relay for Life, which is a 24 hour, you know, then I did the whole 24 hours. And I noticed that that people did not openly communicate about the emotional side of their trauma. They were able to talk about like, the tasks, when am I gonna get my next PET scan? How do I navigate work? What's the best way to reduce stress? What's about the tasks around their their cancer, very, a lot of opinions very open to talk about what when it came to the emotions, they just weren't. And that kind of set a seed for me. I was kind of just shocked by that. And then every year her name was June, every year I did a for June in June, in terms of it, where I'd raised money for the cancer center that took care of her. And I noticed that same recurring theme, where people just weren't able to talk about the emotional side of it. And I thought, hmm, what if I got a group of really diverse people who had varying bouts with cancer, or came from the perspective of a caregiver or a doctor or survivor, loved one, whatever. And they were young, all different types of cancer, different emotional experiences, different sets of childhood traumas, all these wild lead diverse factors. I figured, if I covered as much of the general population as possible, then maybe we could start to understand how to start those conversations, like how like, what are people going through? What have they gone through? And how can we better relate to them so that we can talk about these things that people don't talk about the emotional side of it? So a long answer to your question, but how did the bike ride happened was I thought if we're connected by story, which I think we are, right, you know, you're you're telling stories all the time, people that you have honored telling stories were connected by stories, and were connected by emotions, what better way to connect these things than to get on a bike and go visit the people that I had talked to for a couple of years, but never had never met most of them. And so I thought it would be a good experience to connect that and along the way, I'm trying to see whether or not this thought of people are not equipped to talk about the emotional side of trauma and grief and other things. And every single day Victoria, I that that was reinforced that, you know that this was, even if it doesn't change the world, maybe it'll equip a few people to better understand how to start these hard conversations about the emotional side.

 
Victoria Volk  08:27
That's beautiful. It's a beautiful concept. I love the store. I love it. Because obviously what I do is try to pull out the emotion of people's experiences. And as a grief recovery specialist, I can tell you it is really difficult to to help people to see that going there is healing. It really is.

 
David Richman  08:52
It totally is. And you know, it's understandable why people don't talk like I've learned that through this journey. Because they don't want to say something stupid, they don't want to guilt others they don't want to, like, my life is great. I'm talking about your life, which sucks, and I don't want to make you feel bad. I don't want to feel guilty about how good I feel and how great things are for me. Right? Or people they don't want sympathy. I mean, there's a lot of reasons why you kind of clam up about these things. But I mean, honestly, it's just shocking to me how many people I mean, it's endless, endless people said to me, oh my gosh, I wish I knew what to say or you know I I never really talked to my daughter about this because of XYZ reason. I sure wish I knew how or I sure knew wish where I could start doing that. And and that's what I think these stories do is they shed light on this kind of block that we have about talking about this or dealing even dealing with the emotional side of it. And I think, you know, like, for example, like I just recently just got a note from, from a doctor who retired, forget what kind of oncologist oncologist he was. But he said, When I read your book, the first thing I did was go read it and horror, thinking, oh my gosh, I was not a good enough doctor, I didn't know my patients the way I should have. He says, My let go that thought I read it the second time thinking about how interesting these people were. And I thought to myself, how cool is that? You know, I've gotten plenty of notes from people saying how now I understand, or I better understand or this makes me be able to talk to so and so. And jeez, if I've only affected if the few people that have sent me these kinds of notes, how great is that?

 
Victoria Volk  10:50
Yeah. Can you give an example from your book? One of the story?

 
David Richman  10:54
Yes, I'll give you one of my favorite examples. So, I think that we can all put ourselves in the position of how difficult it might be as a patient. But how about how difficult it may be as an oncologist to deal with patients. And so I interviewed a woman who was absolutely spectacular, she'd been a oncologist specializing in female and male breast cancer for nearly 40 years at NYU. And wow, what a great story she had. And the reason that she was open to talking to me was because she had come to realization, having lived a long, successful life, and having given so much to the community, and we're so passionate about wellness and survivorship. Had a successful marriage had raised a daughter who's grown up and gone off to her own career, she had realized that when she started out as an oncologist, Victoria, she kind of was just super focused on treatment, and care and do things this way, or whatever. And if people didn't really bond with her, listen to her, she just kind of moved on to the next patients. But after 40 years, she realized she was really good at what she did. And it and if people weren't willing to take her medical advice, she wasn't willing to, to help them. Because she knew that she was a very good doctor. And she knew that which that her regimen of, of of care, could enhance their lives, perhaps prevent acceleration of their cancer, maybe even save their life. And she knew if they didn't listen to her, what they might potentially missed out on because she was at a point in her life where she was grateful for so much. And so her dilemma was, how do I walk out of one patient room where somebody wants to not take my advice, and I know if they take my advice, it will help them. And if they don't take my advice, it could potentially be disastrous? How do I walk out of that room and into the next room, where there's a woman with two little kids on our labs, and I've got to tell her that she's gonna die. Right, that there's nothing I can do for her the other woman, I could have done something she won't listen to me this woman, and just how emotionally difficult that was. And then we talked about that issue, around the backdrop of not only being a woman oncologist at a time when women are not becoming doctors, it searches that oncologist and the discrimination that she faced and how she overcame that. But also the fact that, you know, you look at a doctor and think everything's wonderful. But we find out that when she was 12, she came home one day, and her dad just never came home. Like he abandoned the family. And how she was able to go through her life and fix that part of her, or at least reconcile that part of her enough to live a life where she could be loved and where she could love somebody else without this fear of abandonment. And so I thought to myself, after talking to her, You know what, maybe she is much more in tune with being a good provider. But maybe perhaps when somebody comes in and a doctor is not as friendly or not as open or is maybe a little more distant, maybe they're going through their own stuff. Maybe when the doctor comes in, if we could take one second and ask how are you doing? Maybe that doctor just walked out of a room where somebody wouldn't listen to them. And they're so upset about the fact that that they want to help this person and they won't take it. Then they walk into our room. Carrying that into here, maybe maybe they just need a minute of attention. So those are the kinds of things stories that I think maybe will, will open up people's minds to think about how we might better communicate with those around us.

 
Victoria Volk  15:08
Thank you for sharing that, because, to be honest, I had never considered that side of it. Thinking of what that might be like for an oncologist. Right? And I've thought about certain different careers, you know, social workers, you know, going into homes where they have to take the children away, or you know, things like that. But I've never thought of the ecologist. And even just me with this podcast, I'm sure people that you've talked to, it's like, wow, that sounds depressing. Like, the work. You know, the work that I'm doing in grief, recovering stuff, like people will say, Well, that sounds really depressing, right? But I imagined burn ecologist it really is, but it can also be equally rewarding too.

 
David Richman  15:57
Yeah, but I couldn't, I couldn't imagine I could, before I did this project, I couldn't imagine I didn't even let it enter my realm. Like, how in the world? Could somebody be an oncologist? How could somebody deal with this kind of heaviness? I just didn't even let it into my realm. And then when I did let it in my realm, I'm just like, God, there's no way I could ever do that. Are you kidding me? To give bad news to receive, you know, to to watch what I mean, God, it takes a special person to be able to do that. And so I think that I have maybe just another level of respect, admiration, empathy, for people that that deal with this heavy, heavy stuff. There's another one up, gosh, Jen, she was me her story is absolutely amazing. Like, is one of the most heart warming, but also tragic situations ever. She watched her dad die of cancer when she was six years old. And I'm going to condense the story really short, she grew up to be this super happy, lighthearted, wonderful, joyful, life is great kind of person. It's because her mom and her sister in the end kind of really huddled into this loss and to the closeness and just, she just lived in a very safe loving environment, even though she lost her, her dad. And her dad called her nurse Jen, because during hospice, she would bring him like a soda or something, or whatever. And she kind of remember that she ends up going to nursing school. And the last thing she would ever do was was it would end up in an oncology unit, especially a pediatric oncology unit. But she's got to do a rotation. And she does a rotation, she comes home, bawling her eyes out, calls her mom. And it's like, I just did the pediatric oncology rotation, and a mom goes, it'll be okay. And Jen goes, how would I ever not do that? Like I have to, because that's what I have to do. So she does that long, long story, again, to the question of how she deals with the pain of it is because every once in a while I go home, and I have a cat day, I just pet my cat. Because if I let myself think about all of the heaviness, and all of the craziness that I deal with, it would really really bring me down, she goes, I just sometimes just need to check out and pet my cat. Because otherwise, it's just too heavy. And I just go golly, I couldn't handle one day of that she's doing it for her whole life, she's planning on doing it for her whole life. Like it just takes a special kind of person. So, I think that we oftentimes want to just go I don't know how you could go through that as a person with cancer or dealing with some other type of trauma. But the people like you, the professionals that give care and attention to the people that are going through these things, wow, man, that is another level.

 
Victoria Volk  18:56
To that point, kind of a commercial anyway, in my local commercial in our state, where they talk about the mental health of doctors and nurses and you know, stuff like that because as you said, like they're every day they're in this environment of great loss and sadness and, and there's great stories of overcoming to but to not be able to bring that home and but they're just like the rest of us just as equally have the potential to fall victim to addiction and alcohol use and you know, so I can't recall the statistic right now, but it was actually quite high of how many doctors commit suicide. So just wanted to support that point you made and that the emotional health and well being of physicians and caregivers and caretakers. I actually just had a thought I was just pulling weeds in my garden last night and I just thought you know sometimes the Helper needs help too.

 
David Richman  20:03
Yeah. It's, it's, it's really tough. So, so not only the caregiver professional, but also the survivor, the one going through the cancer, just what is their experience. And so, what I, what I, what I did Victoria, as I said, we all kind of have the same emotional responses to trauma, maybe we don't explore those emotions, but we have the same emotional experience, right? Like, for example, if you were stuck in a cave, and a big black bear came in to attack you, you would be fearful. And there's not anybody that wouldn't be fearful. Now, if we were to survive, that, we might, or might not be able to talk about it, or reconcile it, or share it with others or whatever. But we would have all experienced that fear. So what I tried to do was to say, with each story, point A is when they encounter cancer, you know, Jenna's the six year old, Dr. Meyers, as a 14 year old or however old, she was 13 years old, eighth grade trip to the hospital, where she was just like, Oh, my God, I'm going to become a doctor. So point A is then or is patient when you're diagnosed with cancer? Point B is today? How did the emotional journey from point A to point B happen? Or not happen? What you know, how were you able to or not able to deal with the emotional side in relation to the traumas that happen prior to point A, so an example would be Patricia story. And Patricia stories, her cancer journey is just ridiculous to trap it try to wrap your brain around. But she had five different cancers over 35-year period. Could you imagine five different cancers. So basically, she was at the point where she was just like, Whatever, whatever it is, just cut it out. There was really nothing left to cut out and also took care of why she was going through chemo took care of her dad who was dying of prostate, I believe prostate cancer, I don't remember which one, but just in working in survivorship community, and the whole thing like her whole life has been fixated on dealing with her cancer, or helping others better navigate their own cancer journeys. But her story, really Victoria is about that, in relation to the four years that she was basically kept prisoner in a very, very abusive, mentally, physically and emotionally abusive relationship. She gets out of that, and you go, well, how could anybody ever survive that, let alone be open to finding love? And trusting somebody, let alone be able to now start a fight for 30 for the upcoming 35 years of dealing with cancer. And so I think what we can take from that is how strong you could be is just what did you already survive? Right? Because I first thing that I think of, and I think it's pretty normal to think and most people would think of five times cancer for 35 years, there's no way I could have dealt with that. Doing no way possible. And that's where people go like, I can't even imagine like, how who does that who survives 35 years of five different kinds of cancers. And then, if you lit put it into perspective of look at what you survived before that, who hasn't survived trauma, who hasn't overcome difficulty, maybe not to that extent. But yeah, maybe you gathered the tools that you need, and you've drawn them to deal with whatever you need to deal with. And so when she says in this has kind of given away the punch line, but when she says that, you know, I might not gotten very far out of bed. But every single day, my goal was to get about a bed, and I did even if I only took one step. But my goal was to get out of bed every day that I can understand how important that is. And that was one thing that she was able to draw on to keep herself going every single day. And I go, Well, if somebody said that to me originally, like, I go, how did you deal with your cancer and the guy just got out of bed every day. It wouldn't make sense to me sound little trite. But in relation to her story, and what she overcame and what it takes to get out of bed every single day, to try it out with optimism and strength, go about your day and fight whatever comes to you. Now I get it. You know, so I think I can draw from that. Maybe I can understand it a little bit.

 
Victoria Volk  24:35
Can you tell us about June and what she taught you?

 
David Richman  24:38
So, I could tell you that I was always a little jealous of June in one sense that she we both had kind of the same traumatic childhood, right. And we both had the same kind of adversities. But oh my gosh, she found herself her husband has kids had a great career, I had all these friends, and she was so happy. And so, like lighthearted. And meanwhile, I was all rooting and heavy, hard to overcome with all this nonsense. I was always kind of like, Man, she's living her life, she's so happy. So one of the things about him that I remember is that she was just a happy person. And, and that's, that's really hard. But I don't find that many like truly grounded, like, present, just happy people. And the fact that she had that for so many years is a real neat thing to remember about her, you know? And I thought, so. So that's what I remember about her that what does she teach me kind of a lot, you know more about life, I've learned from keeping her present, right after she died keeping her present by embarking on these projects, and, you know, forcing myself to kind of think about her as I'm biking across the country, these kinds of things, that you know, that she's had a really profound effect on my life, if nothing other than the person that holds up a mirror that allows me to, you know, kind of look at myself and examine, you know, and she might be that person that holds up that mirror. And if that's the only thing that she's continuing to do, how grateful Am I that she's doing that? So I think that, you know, what I've learned from this experience, whether she's taught me that, or directly or indirectly, is that examination and dealing with these things, and coming to terms with them, or attempting to come to terms with these difficult things, is a needed aspect of life. Like, we can't just pack everything in a box in our brains and let it collect dust and think that it's like it's done. I think that we got to unpack all these boxes examine at all, and continue stronger, more enlightened, more grounded, more centered, more connected to the people around us. And I think she's helped me do that.

 
Victoria Volk  27:10
So I was, you had mentioned that, at one point, you were kind of downtrodden and kind of woe is me, so to speak. Sure. So, was her diagnosis kind of what pulled you out of that? And then started this mission that you have now?

 
David Richman  27:27
Yeah, it kinda is a great question. And it all kind of happened, right about the same time. So I was in a very bad situation personally. And I had young twins four years old. And we had to get out of that situation. And it was I was unhealthy. I was a smoker, I was overweight, I had a ton of stress in my life, both personally and professionally. And I had to make a change. And at that same time, Jun called me and told me that she had got news about a tumor, brain tumor. And so all of that happened at the same time. And so I don't think it was that event that made me change. But it was the series of events that happened kind of all at the same time, where I thought to myself, you know, you can, you can go through life reacting to things, or you can try to maybe for once in your life, take a hold of the things that in your life and determine your own course. And so I think that, prior to that point, I was I, I was in a very negative space, even though I had some great things happened to me, but I just, I don't know, I just didn't feel connected to who I am. And, and, and I felt like I wasn't doing anything on purpose. I wasn't doing everything because I got to do it. I was doing everything accidentally, and because I had to, but then I just kind of changed that mindset and said, No, no, no, no, you gotta, you gotta fix this stuff. And you got you gotta start thinking about, you know, the person in the mirror rather than, you know, what am I doing to make the boss happy? Or what am I doing to make the wife happier, you know, you know, doing things because I think I have to write, I got to start doing things because I get to do them. And that really, that really kind of 180y view on on on life and my perspective on things if that makes any sense.

 
Victoria Volk  29:32
Yeah, you began to live with intention. Yeah. what it sounds like. 

 
David Richman  29:34
Yeah, absolutely. 

 
Victoria Volk  29:36
So have you worked through then, like, where did you start like, because the you didn't specifically say what you experienced in childhood, but I like to think that adulthood is childhood reenactments? And so the experiences that you had in childhood, obviously were are impacting you in adulthood, which I feel like is the absolute truth for all of us. Unless they're addressed. How did you start? Where did you start?

 
David Richman  30:10
Yeah, that's a good question. And like, I'm, I'm still in the midst, as I'm hoping everybody, I still in the midst of trying to be better, right, trying to figure it out, I always say that I have kind of everything in common with the person that thinks their best days are ahead of them. And not much in common with the person that thinks their best days are behind them. Right? I just don't have because I feel like we're, we got to constantly evolve, we got to constantly try better, we got to constantly learn. And, you know, sometimes I'll fall into a pattern where guy that patterns been around for decades. And it's caused me to act a certain way or react a certain way. And then I go, oh, you know, I could do better. And it's like, well, if I still believe that after doing the same thing, the wrong way for 30 years, well, okay, I'll, that's I, I'm comfortable with that. You know, like that I could do better. So I think where it started was, I honestly, I did get my kids in the out of this bad situation. And I just said to myself, Look, dude, you're in your 30s. I was in my late 30s, at this point. And I said, you're overweight, you're a smoker, you're not healthy, you're not happy. You're not doing the things you want to do. I literally, Victoria stood in front of a mirror, going, who do you want to be? Like, literally, like, who do you want to be? Who do you want to be? Do you want to be this bitter kind of sarcastic kind of like, you know, like, take on the world by yourself? And just woe is me and whatever kind of person or do you want to just like, like, become something else? Who do you want to be? And the first thing I wanted to be was healthy. I said, if I'm going to be alone with my kids, I want to be around and, and, and, you know, especially in light of finding out that my sister was gonna die soon, or it might die soon from her cancer. And I thought, geez, man, I got to start becoming healthy. Well, how do you become healthy? While you stop smoking? How do you stop smoking, when you start running? Because you can't run in Smoke certainly can't swim in smoke. So, I'll start swimming and run it. Right? Because that'll stop me from smoking. And that was step one. And then okay, well, now that I'm healthy, I got to start losing weight. Because, you know, trying to run with 30, or 40, or 50 extra pounds on you is a lot harder than running without those extra pounds. And then I thought, Well, why don't you sleep better? Why don't you reduce stresses, once you get rid of people in your life that are bad influences? Or that you that aren't positive friends that don't uplift you? Why don't you when you go to work, why don't you start doing things? Because it's the right thing for you to do not the right thing that you think your boss says you should do. Right? Why don't you treat employees the way you want to be treated? Not the way you think that they want to be treated. But right. So I just started, like you said with intention, one thing after another after another after another. So it's just it started at that point. And, and honestly, that was the beginning of a February of that year. And by March, I had identified K by July, I'd done a half Ironman, and by November, I did a full Ironman. So I said, I'm gonna take it on, and I really took it.

 
Victoria Volk  33:25
Wow, what year was this?

David Richman  33:28
This was so my kids were five. So that was 1998 or so.

 
Victoria Volk  33:36
That was when your sister was diagnosed as well?

 
David Richman  33:39
Wait, wait, no, I was wrong. That would be 2003. My kids are born in in in 1998. So that would have been 2003. Yeah,

 
Victoria Volk  33:49
That you changed your life just almost 20 years ago. And when your sister was diagnosed? Yes. Yeah.

 
David Richman  33:55
So that was 2003. She died in 2007. And I did events for a number of years, and then took on this project starting in about 2011 or 12. So it took me a long time to put together the book to make sure that I had the right people to just a couple years ago, do the bike ride connected all that I had to go through my editing and find it find the right publisher and go through their editing and the whole thing. It's, it's, you know, it's not easy to put a project like this together. But yeah, that whole journey. In fact, I've been doing endurance athletics now for close to 20 years. And, you know, Mike, my kids know me as the, you know, they were five years old, six years old, when when they were running across the finish line with me, you know, and that's all they know me as and so it's kind of cool.

 
Victoria Volk  34:50
So, who inspires you today?

 
David Richman  34:53
Oh, wow. I think I'm more inspired not by a person, but I'm inspired by the belief that, that you can have an effect on others, even if it's only an effect on my kids, my wife myself, you can have an effect on others. I'm inspired by that I'll never forget, I was embarrassed one year, because I did an event to raise money for the cancer center that took care of June. And I was kind of embarrassed by the fact that I only raised a couple $1,000 That year, it wasn't, it wasn't that big of a deal. And I told that to the person that was coordinating the whole thing. And she goes, What are you kidding me? She goes, Do you know how many times we tell your story to donors? Do you know how many times we tell people Oh, this guy did, you know, this 87-mile run in Mexico. And it was to honor his sister. And he did this solo ride and run in Mexico, 22 and a half hours. And we we say those are the kinds of people that are dedicated to our center. And that raises us endless amounts of money. She goes, so just the fact that you let us tell your story is, is enough. And I'm just like, oh, that's kind of cool, right? So even if even if it only affects one person, but I had no idea that they were bragging about my story, which was nothing to me. And, and it was helping them. And in these other ways, I think I'm inspired by the fact that you never know what good thing you might be doing, or what positive thing you might be doing, that might affect other people, and that they might carry on, you know, for a long time. So I think that's what inspires me to continue to do these things is that even has a positive effect on one person, that's good enough for me.

 
Victoria Volk  36:37
I agree. And for those listening who feel like, because I struggled for a very long time, like I had this innate sense that I could do more I was made for more like my potential was not being met. And I always thought, what is it going to look like? For me helping people like what does that look like? And so for anyone listening? What is something that it because you don't have to ride 87 miles or, you know, 4700 miles to have an impact, right? So are there stories that you have people who you've met along the way who have done who have had equal impact, but maybe don't think so or just for some examples for people to offer?

 
David Richman  37:22
Sure, you came every single day on that ride. And certainly, a ton of other times throughout this whole kind of cycle of lives journey. I've run into people who just like, if I talk about it, it's as fresh as if it happened yesterday. And it's probably something they've never thought of again. But it it touches me in a way where I just go, I people are remarkable. So I'll give you two quick stories. So one is I was at the end of one of the most ridiculous days ever, like 17 hours, 156 miles, I like five flats. I was a soloists and have support that day. And I suppose on my own from morning until night, it was absolutely 17 hours on a bike, which is just, it's just unbelievable. And this was like, day 30. So it's like I mean, I'm, I'm not it's like I'm not fresh. Want to start that day, right, huh? Anyway, so I get to the hotel, and the night manager is working the desk and she comes running around the corner. Because only God we were afraid you weren't gonna make it. I go okay, because all the hotels were donated, right. And I was on a schedule. And she was I was so interested to meet you. Because my grandfather just passed away from cancer a couple of weeks ago. And he and I were so close. And I was hoping I got to meet you and I read about what you're doing. I think it's so great. And I'd love to make a donation. And I went oh, that's really sweet. Right How nice. So, the only open restaurant at that time was like midnight was like a Burger King. So, I got back on my bike and went through the Burger King Drive thru. And and got myself a burger went to my room. And I get a call from this dis manager. And I go Yeah, what's up and she goes, well, I went on your site and made a donation and it was a it was a very modest donation. Okay, very modest. And but didn't matter to me, right? Yeah, I'm just touched that somebody would take take the time and she said I was wondering, is that a one-time donation or is that a monthly thing? Because I don't know if I could afford that much monthly. And I went no, no, no, it was one time donation it doesn't matter. It's really really sweet of you. So it was just like, what I might have easily taken for granted that dollar amount. Right just ease it was such a big deal for her that she was afraid that she couldn't afford that much monthly, but she still wanted to give I was just like oh, brings tears to my I know how sweet is that? So, another story is at the end of another really tip clip that every story starts with at the end of a difficult day. So, I did have a friend supporting me that day. And we found a restaurant that was open a little Italian restaurant, starving, and I started eating the meal. And we're talking about the event and what I'm doing whatever and the waitress overhears it, she starts asking questions, and the owner comes over, oh, everybody in my family has been touched by cancer one way or another, bla bla, bla bla bla, appreciate what you're doing. Love to buy you the meal. Wow, that's pretty sweet. Because little family restaurant, it's in the middle of Louisiana. You know, like, they're not, you know, they're not a chain restaurant that can afford to be comping meals all night long. So, I was really touched by that. And then at the end of the night, when we finished our meal, that's three waitresses that we're working on, I came over and wanted to take a picture with me, I thought is really sweet. And they handed me an envelope. And it had, again, a very modest sum of money. And I said, no, no, you don't have to do that. They go know what you're doing is amazing. We wanted to give you our tips for the night as a support. And I said, oh, my God, they work the entire night. Maybe second jobs, I'm guessing in Louisiana, the minimum wage is not very high. And they were so moved by this stranger they came in to give me their tips for the night so that we could, you know, continue to raise money. And I just thought, God, people are so nice. Right? Like, like, so. So, the impact that that had and how many times I've told those stories, those are just two of 1000 stories I could tell and have told, that just reminded me of how remarkable people are and what how a little gesture could go so far. You could go so far.

 
Victoria Volk  41:47
And I think too sometimes when we tell people Oh, no, no, please don't do that. Or, you know, we are taking away their opportunity to feel joy, oh, their opportunity to give. And I, I someone, I don't know, I had an instance or experience some time ago that really made me realize that that we have one hand forgiving and one hand for receiving and it's just as important to be able to receive as it is to give and for people who have a hard time receiving. You know, it's really easy to say, oh, no, no, please don't. You know, yeah, I've been so important. It's so important for the giver, though.

 
David Richman  42:29
Yeah, I've been that person my whole life, I have literally just started learning how to allow people to help me because it's what they want to do. And I need to give them the opportunity to do what they want to do just as they give me the opportunity to do what I want to do. It's something I'm pleased learning because I you know, I come this guy who was totally self reliant. So, then I I able to do the things that I need to do because I have to do them, right. Because I had to, well, who doesn't? We're all kind of that person. And then I go, no, like, I'm hosting a bunch of people. And I go, no, no, I got I got it. No, do you need help cutting? No, I got Do you need help prep? No, I got Do you need help setting up? No, Are you relaxed? I got it. me while I'm sitting there. God, I'm controlling the whole situation. I'm not giving them the opportunity to do what they want to do. Which is help. It's a hard lesson to learn. But it's it's an important one. And I literally Victoria as old as I am. As much as I'd been through. I'm just now understanding that, that you know what, when people offer help, it's not because they think you can't do it. It's because they wanna help.

 
Victoria Volk  43:35
Right. We often have that story in our head like, yeah, like you just said, like, will you know, we we believe that for whatever reason, we got it, we can take care of it all or we have you know, we've always done that, or we have the story that they think they think I can't do it. Well show them. You know.

 
David Richman  43:55
I know, yeah. If that's our own garbage, it still is, you know what it is? It is really nice, because when I go to somebody else's house, I feel uncomfortable if I'm not helping. And here I am making everybody feel uncomfortable, because I'm not allowing them to help.
 

Victoria Volk  44:10
Yeah, we go against the law of reciprocity.

 
David Richman  44:14
So, I'm glad we're able to talk about this because it's kind of keep it in the front of my mind to always let people help if they want.

 
Victoria Volk  44:21
Yeah. So, what is one tip that you've, and I'm sure you have many but something that really sticks out to you that you've heard through other people's stories, a tip that you would give other hurting hearts.

 
David Richman  44:37
Okay, well, I'm gonna give it to you because you're such a good interviewer. But I never give this one away because it gives away the ending of the book, but I'm going to tell you to tell you because it's such a great question and and I know that not everybody has time to read books and whatever, but it's a lesson that I learned and came to my Consciousness literally at the very end of my bike ride. So, you know, I set out on this whole thing to start to heart conversations and better equip people to understand what they've gone through and all this other stuff. So I'm at the end of the ride, I'm literally like, on the other side of the George Washington Bridge, trying to figure out how to get into and, and navigate to the right place in Central Park. I don't know where to go. And I see these two cyclists and they're talking and I wait for them to finish. And I and I talked to one of them, and I say, hey, how do I get over the bridge? And where do I go? Where? Where do I turn what I do? So she gave me directions. And then she noticed on my jersey, that I had a stupid cancer logo, one of those charities that cyclists project supports. And by the way, all the proceeds from the book, go to support the cancer focus charities that were picked by the book participants. And she goes, Oh, my gosh, are you doing a ride? And I go, Yeah, she was would you ride from and I said, Oh, I came from Manhattan Beach. She was from Manhattan, like downtown Manhattan. I go, No, Manhattan Beach, California. She was like, what? And so we started talking for a minute she was Oh my god. It's because I'm a cyclist. Because my dad. So that's kind of cool. And because yeah, I died four years ago from cancer. And the only thing he really wanted to do was to ride his bike, and I go, Oh, my gosh, I go, what was he like? And she told me a couple of stories. And then she said, Oh, my God, you want to hear a story about his funeral. And so she told me this crazy story about his funeral. And I'm just like, oh, my gosh. And I said, Well, you know, what do you think about when you're when you're writing and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And so we have like this, I don't know, seven, eight minute conversation. And I went my way, and she went her way will never talk to me or see each other ever pass will never cross again. And as I'm biking across the bridge, I'm thinking to myself, when I started this journey, if somebody would have told me, other father died of cancer four years ago, I would have went, Oh, I'm sorry. I'm sorry to hear that. Oh, I'm sorry. And I would have uncomfortably exited the conversation? And what about my wife? But now, I know that that was an invitation for me to ask, Oh, we close? How do you feel about it? Wow, it's been four years, you know, how does that affect you? Or Wow, tell me about him, or whatever. And it had this great. You know, uplifting, wonderful, even if it was, it ends up being a heavy conversation, which sometimes it does. But it's this, this nother level of connection where somebody says, You know what, even if it was a total stranger, they heard me or for me, I'm the total stranger who somebody's interested to tell a couple of these very intimate stories to, and the way that, so it was a little practical joke. He loved. He loved cycling so much. And everybody used to make fun of the fact that he had this one jersey, that had all these little ice cream cones all over it, this one little bike jersey. So he said to his daughter, hey, you know, when you do the viewing, put me in my little ice cream cone, Jersey. And he thought that would put a smile on everybody's face. And I thought to myself, how sweet is that? If I'd never asked her that story, I would have never, if I never asked her about her dad, I would have never got the story. And this was whatever, three, four years ago. I don't think it's ever left me the vision of a guy lying in his coffin wearing a ice cream cone cycling jersey just to put a smile on people's faces. How wonderful is that? And so, very long answer to your question of what do you learn? That's something to learn. It's just lean in, like have the conversation don't don't be afraid to say something stupid. Right? And oftentimes, that question I'll follow up with is where you close to them? Because might be a stupid question. Like, of course I was was my dad, you idiot. But most nobody's gonna say that. You're either gonna say no, I wish I was closer, or they're gonna say yeah, actually, I was. And Baba, and I'll be a prompt to continue to have you have a little bit of a connection to them. So again, sorry for the long answer. But But I think it's what I've learned is that leaning in that asking a question that being able to be vulnerable, allow them to be vulnerable, but it's safe in a safe place that you really care. That's what I've learned is that's that's, you know, there's that's where some beauty lies and all of this nonsense.

 
Victoria Volk  49:40
I completely picked up on that right away. You asked her, you asked her about him, and I think it's really giving people that permission to share because sometimes people feel like, especially as Grievers. They don't want to, you know, bring the mood down or make someone else you know, we're, you know, I could go into a lot of stuff with Christopher Recovery and everything I've learned, but it's really about permission. I think for a lot of Grievers.

 
David Richman  50:06
What you said is about us being, you know, would you say grown up kids or whatever? 

 
Victoria Volk  50:14
Well, I think it's being curious. 

 
David Richman  50:15
Yeah. But the earlier when you said we're just like, grown up, kids are something.

 
Victoria Volk  50:19
Oh, yeah. Adulthood is childhood reenactments. 

 
David Richman  50:23
Yeah. And what are kids want? They just want to be safe. And so, if you're safe, if you're given permission, and somebody you know that somebody is asking a question, because they care. Yeah, then Be safe, be free to give the answer and allow them to care. It's it’s a weird dynamic, because I it's totally understandable what you just said, you don't want to bring people down. You don't want to make them feel guilty. You don't want to. But you know what, they gave me permission to talk talk. And so I what I learned is to lean in more and to talk and ask questions, and to give people permission to talk about whatever they're going through.

 
Victoria Volk  51:04
Yeah, it's my mission too.

 
David Richman  51:07
Nice. Well, that's why we're aligned. 

 
Victoria Volk  51:09
Yeah. So, what are ways that others have supported you that you have found to be helpful as you transformed your life?
 

David Richman  51:19
Oh, my gosh, there, there is endless people, right. So, people have taught me how to be a better athlete. Right there people taught me how to how to have work life balance. I met, I met my wife, who has been unbelievably supportive of the things that I want to do. So to find somebody that believes in you is really amazing, right? It's really amazing. Maybe she came along, when, when I would have allowed somebody to believe in me, because maybe I believe in myself a little bit more. But, um, she's been great help. My kids have been a wonderful help, because they are very close to them. They're pretty talkative. And we're, you know, we're pretty open about the effect that we've had on each other, and, you know, life has had on us and that kind of stuff. So I think that I mean, there's just been endless people and endless circumstances that have helped me. And I think that probably does boil down to that. Like what you said a while ago, living with intention. I think it's like, living on purpose, you know, like, like really taking charge of what you want to do and who you want to be. And being okay with that, you know, every once a while guy used to think it was so stupid. Well, I wouldn't tell anybody I'm going to go running. Because I was an overweight smoker. What do I have any business doing range? I would hide? I would just do it on one. Tell me, buddy. Right? Because I was embarrassed well, from living on purpose. I don't care what anybody else thinks only matters what I think, right? If I'm a runner, I'm gonna go for a run, I'm gonna tell people, I'm gonna sign up for a marathon. I'm gonna tell you why not living like living on purpose, what I care what anybody else thinks only matters what I think. So I think that fortunately, surrounding myself with people who were supportive, or additive, or at least not detractors. What I was doing that that has helped me along the way, for sure.

 
Victoria Volk  53:34
Well, I can see why you would hide that. Because if I were in those shoes, I would feel like, well, they're probably just gonna say that. Oh, yeah, you've said that before. Or people say that all the time. And then it's like that fear of failing, not for them, but for yourself. So if I speak it out loud, you know, it's almost like this feeling on my drink my jinx myself, you know, totally. What if, what if I don't follow through with this? Or what if? And I've already told people, right, so it's almost like you're creating your own safety blanket of Well, I'm not. I'm kind of committed, but I'm not committed because I didn't tell anybody else. Was that part of it, too?

 
David Richman  54:16
Absolutely. Absolutely. And, you know, I guess a lot of people don't start things because they're afraid that they're going to fail, right. And I would do that. Whatever I took on I knew I was going to succeed, but I wouldn't take on things I possibly could fail X. I didn't want to fail, right. So, I never tried to quit smoking until I quit smoking. Because that right? Never tried to become an athlete until I became an athlete because I didn't want to fail at it. It's like a member of that. I don't know if you remember the scene in the movie, The Matrix when they're getting ready to fight for the first time. And Laurence Fishburne looks at calories and he says stop trying to hit me and just hit me. Right So I didn't want to try to do something, I just wanted to do it. Right. And so when I felt like it was okay to be this person, then I would use what you just said to my benefit, I would say to somebody, I'd go, guess what I'm gonna go do, I'm gonna go do 50 mile run, right? Look, I paid this entrance fee, I'm doing a 50 mile run, and then I have to do want to fail. So, so I use it to my benefit, right? Once I knew that I would do whatever it takes to accomplish it, like I had done it, you know, throughout my life on things that I had to do, right? Had to put food on the table or whatever, or you just figure it out. But this living on purpose, and doing it with intention, and being who you want to be or becoming who you want to try and become who you want to be. Um, yeah, then I would put it out there knowing that I wasn't gonna fail, if I was gonna do something I was gonna do it. And but be confident, right? If you want to lose weight, if you want to be a better friend, if you want to work more, if you want to start a business, you want to do whatever, do it. But but you know what, you got to get out there and do it. And you got to tell people, you're going to do it, you got to know there's no way you're not going to succeed, and you got to just get out there and try to do it. And that is a different way of living your life. And it's, it's really wonderful because I don't care about failing. I don't care if I don't finish something. I don't care if I. But if I if I go into it with good intention, I go into it with purpose. And I do my best effort. That's all I can ask.

 
Victoria Volk  56:37
Do you think one thing that keeps people from following through is lack of accountability? Do you think accountability is the missing piece for a lot of people?

 
David Richman  56:47
Yeah, it's a great question. I'm part of a group right now, where we're dealing with that issue of accountability. And yes, yes. Now, there are people that are more accountable to others than they are to themselves. Right. So they won't tell other people because they don't want to be held accountable. Or they won't believe it in themselves, because then they'd have to hold themselves accountable. And so I'm the kind of person where I am probably equally motivated by not wanting to let myself down as I am by not wanting to let other people down. Right. But I like this idea of accountability, having a partner that's that holds you accountable, or group that holds you accountable. Or just write something down that you have to look at it as your own self accountability. But accountability is kind of like a score board. It's kinda like a scoreboard. I don't know very many sports that are played without an accountability without the score. Right? Yeah, we're all winners and losers, we win. Sometimes we lose sometimes right? Hack in baseball, if you're 5050, you're doing pretty good. So, you know, I mean, as a win loss as a team, you're doing pretty good. So. But without a scoreboard without accountability, you don't have anything. So yeah, I totally agree with that. Totally agree with accountability.

 
Victoria Volk  58:12
So, throughout your life, what has given you the most joy, and hope for the future too?

 
David Richman  58:20
Oh, I think the most joy has come from learning how to lean into positive relationships, I think that's where the joy is come from. I'd say second to that is trying to be happy, allow myself to be happy, right. I always felt like for a long time before I thought, I'm gonna try to get to a point and then I'll be happy, right? We've got a better job and be happy for give me more money, I'll be happy. If I just get a little bit healthier, I'll be happy. If I lose a little more weight, I'll be happy or whatever the thing is that we tell ourselves like when this happens, then everything will be okay. That never happens. So, you know, whatever you're trying to get to get to be an emotionally better place. Whenever you get to that point, you're not an emotionally better place. It's just it's just delusional. So I have learned or am attempting to continue to learn how to be happier and content and joyful and present and kind of grounded no matter what's going on. Right? So I say, being happy has given me the most happiness being joyful has given me the most joy that and positive relationships. So I said a distant third is his writing, you know, so So writing is sort of given me a lot of joy as well. So, I think those those three things.

 
Victoria Volk  1:00:01
That's wonderful. Those are good. Those are great. Yeah. I could actually go into another side thing about energy, because I was, I was kind of wanting to get into that about just the energy of emotion and how it gets stuck in us and then leads to disease. Do you have any quick thoughts about that? Based on the stories that you've heard from people and, and how you've connected the dots, to? It's not just one grieving experience. It's always many, right?

 
David Richman  1:00:37
Many. I mean, we don't know what people have gone through what we've gone through. Like, one of the things that was amazing about this, this journey was I talked to tons and tons of people as potential book participants. What's amazing is no matter how incredible, the story seemed, to me, every single person said, and my story's not that interesting, right? I'm just like, wow, you went through, you know, the suicide of a parent, escaping, you know, certain death, you know, like, all these crazy things that you experienced. And it's like nothing, it's like, we're just living, you know, people are just living the lives we live. Okay. So I do believe that some people benefit from believing in the negative. Like, some people like, ah, like, give you all this attention to all this negativity. And that's what keeps me going. And there's some people who draw themselves to all this positivity. And that's what keeps him going. I'm not really sure if I know if there's a cause between negativity and stress and negative ailments, or whatever. But I will say for certain that whether each person believes it or not, Victoria, there was something unbelievably uplifting and inspiring and hopeful and positive, underlying these negative experiences, maybe at the time, there wasn't anything positive about what they went through. But how it affected others, or where they came out on the other side, or, you know, whatever, there was some amount of positivity, and it's the it's the negative stuff that, that that kind of, like, makes us react and makes us feel Ouch, in the pain. It's like, oh, man, that's rough. But it's a positive, uplifting, hopeful stuff that stays with us. And so I, I think that it's okay, to have any kind of positive or negative energy help get you through a situation. But let's, let's try to remember that the positive, the the positivity, the uplifting part of it, the inspiring the hopeful, the forward thinking, optimistic that we can take from these things, that's what lingers, right. That's what lingers, so. So whatever you need to do to get through the situation, fine. But I really tried to tend to focus on the positive and the uplifting and, you know, I, I get this thing from everybody. Sorry for rambling a little bit, but everybody reads the book tells me Oh, my gosh, I thought it was going to be so depressing. And so, so rough to get through. And every one of these stories, even though sometimes they're so rough, they're like kind of inspirational, right? And I go, Yeah, yeah, they are. And so what we can take from these negative experiences or difficulties in life, or periods where we need to grieve or go through trauma, is that there is something on the other side, right. Let me tell you, I tell you a quick story about Terry. So Terry's His person who, oh my God first, I was so asked my wife, I was so reticent to tell her story, because I thought I might make her sound pitiful. Okay, that's what I thought, okay, because she had been kind of abandoned by her family. She gets cancer, on a way to hospital. Her boyfriend, her fiancee says, I Sorry, I'm out. I can't handle this, by the way, again, somebody else pregnant, you know, you're you're on your own. Then she goes in support groups for her particular type of cancer. And basically, everyone in the support group dies. So she's been in there, she gets a recurrence of that cancer has to go in for a bone marrow transplant. I a second one. And what happens during the post care? The person that's supposed to take care of her says, I can't handle this. I'm not strong enough. You're on your own. Sorry. You're on your own. Oh, my God. You want to talk about somebody? She's just trying to figure out why am I here like Everybody abandons me, everybody dies. I'm not supposed to be living, I can't accomplish the things I want in life. And it's just like, Oh my God. And almost everybody tells me her story is so inspiring. Because at the end, what she tells me is, she goes, Look, I live in a world of eyes, I got a 5% chance of this, I got a 95% chance of that she was I flipped the eyes to 5050 things are gonna happen, or they're not. And she goes, all I want to do every day is wake up to see the sun to try to figure it all out. That's it. That's my goal. Maybe I will maybe I won't 5050 chance. And I thought to myself, with everything that she's gone through, how inspiring is it? How hopeful is how amazing is it, that she's able to have this kind of 5050 view on things are gonna happen? Or they're not all I'm looking to do is to get up one more day to try to figure it all out? Is that what we all try to do? And with what she's been through, she still has that kind of positive, optimistic, Hey, son comes up. It'll help me figure it all out. How cool is that? So anyway, again, another rambling answer to your question. But it's those type of stories that I think are just so inspirational.

 
Victoria Volk  1:06:24
And I think you're speaking to what my message is, too. And what I try, and share is that there is another side of it, but you have to like move your feet, you have to take action. It's not just gonna happen on its own. I always say to, it's like you're suffering already, you might as well suffer and move your feet.

 
David Richman  1:06:44
Oh, it's so true. In my first black, that was, you know, not like an industry book, or last level book or something, but was a book, I talked about this time that I did this event. And it was a first endurance event I did, I was still smoking at the time, I did it at seven mile rollerblade race from Athens, Georgia, to Atlanta, Georgia, at seven miles on rollerblades, oh, my gosh, completely stupid. And I had no business doing that. And at some point about 50 miles in, I was trying to rollerblade up this hill, I was spent of every single thing I could be spent up. I was pissed off at myself that I was a smoker, I was pissed off at myself that I was there, I was so angry. I was so like, this is not you. This is just not you. And I'm sitting there absolutely dead on my feet. Right. And I'm looking at this white sweat the soul sweat salty, right? Because the sweat was so as dripping on the asphalt. And it's creating this line, it's going down this hill. And I said, I'm comparing perpendicular to that. So I won't slide down the hill. And I'm looking down. And I remember having this thought of as much as you think you're don't belong here. As much as you've given 100% of everything that you have, there's no possible way you could go forward. And then I thought to myself, Well, every step with a rollerblade. But every point that I go forward from here is a place I've never been is a brand new experience brand new me. Like every, if I could just take one step, I'm gonna find out something new. I'm gonna it's gonna be a territory and never been before. That was really empowering. So to what you said, yeah, if you can just keep your feet moving, you're gonna discover stuff, you're gonna find out a whole new you what you're going to encounter something that you never would have if you didn't move your foot forward. So I totally, totally ascribe to that opinion.

 
Victoria Volk  1:08:53
It's I think it's so easy to get caught up in the story of what happened to us or, you know, that we just allow it to dictate every action therefore, you know, moving forward. And yeah, so, yeah, I think we're on the same mission. Let's bring hope that there's hope. 

 
David Richman  1:09:19
Yeah, and there is a look at this. Some people have it rougher than others. And I don't want to say that other than it's just, it's just life, right? You might look at me and go, I could never have gotten through the things you've gotten through and I look at you and go, what are you kidding me? I could have never gotten through the things you've gone through, but we're just getting through it we get through. Right? The point is, is that we have a finite amount of time, we might as well make the most of it. We might as well try to be the best we can be right what's that famous saying? I'd rather be an optimist and wrong than a pessimist and right. Right. So, I might as well try and might as well try to take that one step forward.

 
Victoria Volk  1:09:58
It was not even try, right? It comes back to you just do, just do. Me. Yeah, my husband helps, my husband, he just drives me crazy. This was before my personal development and stuff that I you know, stuff working on myself, but he would always say there's no such thing as try you either do or you don't? Yeah, it's true. It's true grab life by the handlebars right?

 
David Richman  1:10:20
By the handlebars and take one step forward, just do it.

 
Victoria Volk  1:10:25
Is there anything else you'd like to share?.

 
David Richman  1:10:27
And now if anybody wants to read the book, you could buy it wherever. And like I said before, 100% of the proceeds are going to support the cancer focus charities, and it's not the money, it's more the hope that, you know, if you read the book, maybe you can relate to one more person that needs you to relate to them. Or you can allow one more person to relate to you, because that's what you need. So, you know, I think the bigger goal of trying to equip people to better have these conversations to more easily have these conversations to understand what other people are going through, or to allow people to understand what we're going through or have gone through. It's a really important facet of trauma. It's a really important facet. Because, as I know that some people have it way harder than we do. But everybody has it hard in one way or another. Everybody does. Right? If we can just help them or allow them to help us or just help each other, get through it, or try to get through it. Right? How great is that? So, I guess I'd be the last thing I'd say if anybody's interested do that. And I think, you know, hopefully the book will help.

 
Victoria Volk  1:11:40
Where can people find you?

 
David Richman  1:11:44
They can find me at cycleoflives.org.

Victoria Volk  1:11:48
Okay, and are you on social media at all? 

 
David Richman  1:11:50
I am on Facebook, and Instagram. Just all you got to do is look up David Richman, or cycle of lives or both. And you'll find me I often post about, you know, inspiring cancer stuff, inspiring life stuff. Also, kind of quasi documents, some of the crazier athletic things that I do. And so yeah, it's it's pretty fun.

 
Victoria Volk  1:12:15
Awesome. I will put all the links in the show notes as well. So, look there, if you want to connect. Yeah, thank you so much for being here and sharing all of the wisdom that you've gained throughout your experience of cycle of lives and with your sister and sharing her story with us as well. Thank you.

 
David Richman  1:12:34
Oh, you're welcome. And thank you for asking so many great questions. You're very good at what you do. And I know that you're helping people so keep it up.

Victoria Volk  1:12:42
Thank you. And remember, when you unleash your heart, you unleash your life. Much love. From my heart to yours, thank you for listening. If you liked this episode, please share it because sharing is caring. And until next time, give and share compassion by being hurt with yours. And if you're hurting know that what you're feeling is normal and natural. Much love my friend.